Ben H.
Me:
Frank J. has a good idea on how to improve the economy and decrease illegal immigration at the same time: Give California to Mexico.
Ben:
So we’re supposed to give away silicon valley and hollywood, this does anything good how? Republican rhetoric ftl
Me:
Umm… California needing a bailout…. pretty self-explanatory.
besides, it’s a joke.
Ben:
Your posts seem conflicted, and what a shame there aren’t more republican comedians.
Me:
What’s conflicted? California needs a bailout, therefore it is a drain on the American economy. And who cares about parties? Though if you insist, I would rather not be in the same party as the majority of egotistical, amoral celebrities; comedians and otherwise.
Ben:
Was it a joke or not then? The American economy is in the drain and in need of bailout itself, god-forbid one of fifty states be in the same boat.
Me:
Yes, it’s a joke, but only because taking the small distance where Mexico borders California and turning it into most of the inland California border wouldn’t actually help with immigration one whit.
Me:
As for the economy, do you have no economic sense? You think the country needs a bailout, huh? Where does this bailout come from? The government. Where does the government get it’s money? The country, either by taxation or by reducing the value of the private sector’s money by printing more money.
So we’re broke and we think the solution is to give ourselves more money.
Ben:
Bonds are out there to be bought if you like, an existing system without increasing taxes or ridiculous inflation. Bailout is just a new buzzword used on any market that’s underperforming, the current world and national economies certainly included.
Me:
Jeez. Let me re-iterate: Do you have no economic sense? A bond is you loaning money to the government, right? This is the same government that’s going to roughly double it’s debt during Obama’s presidency (his own numbers). If the government was a debtor in the private sector, it’d have declared bankruptcy a million times over. Not the sort of entity I want to lend money to.
The long and short of it is that money has to come from somewhere, and fancy financial maneuvers only create the illusion of more money. The only way to truly be economically sound is to produce and not spend money like a child with Bill Gates’ fortune in a candy store. The predicament we’re in has been caused by the government borrowing and overspending for decades. Let’s not exacerbate it further.
Ben:
There aren’t many things that scale to the size of the US government to the point of making Bill Gates look like a pauper, and they don’t quite have the option or likelyhood of becoming insolvent. The wonders of the public sector. Bonds are… a temporary solution to be sure, but that’s the hole you’re looking to plug at the same time. Governments can’t simply cease to exist overnight financially or in terms of reducing spending, and at the same time again meeting the expenditures with income is an obvious necessity. Even something as large as public healthcare isn’t likely to, or at least shouldn’t, remain free, it will just become a public option that isn’t in it for a purely profit motive supported by it’s customers.
Me:
Bonds are not a temporary solution. They’re not a solution at all. Going into debt unnecessarily is never a solution. When you’re spending trillions of dollars, the best way to stop building your debt is to stop spending trillions of nonexistent dollars.
And for the record, the whole country does not need a bailout. The federal government does, but take a look at the geographic distribution of the economic plummets sometime. Most of my coworkers at Bojangles were either immigrants or northerners; i.e. people coming to the South for jobs.
And why can’t a government simply reduce spending? Eliminating the nightmares of Medicare, Medicaid, and Social Security (to some degree; I mean, keep paying the people who paid money into Social Security, but let it cycle out) A generation… or two would feel some pain, but in the end some taxes could be cut to ease the individual and other freed taxes used to begin making some kind of dent on the deficit. The bill will eventually come due. Whether it’s in the form of Chinese attack, government implosion, or something else, it will come due. Remember, the “temporary solution” you speak of was a “temporary solution” in the 30s, and look where we are today.
Ben:
Bonds are absolutely a solution to plug government debt when needed, look at the second world war, the problem is convincing people to buy something akin a long term CD. While Bojangles is certainly the perfect source for our countries econ…omic picture, a lot of northern industry has been declining for years. Many of the car companies having financial issues isn’t a new problem, there just wasn’t as likely a source of government backup for them, and most immigrants support the corporations they work for and move money around as they live, a significant portion of their excess income won’t stay in the country.
Medicaid, particularly recently has been cutting back on excess spending, particularly on previously covered medications, and by promoting preventative care.
It’s a temporary solution that worked, I wouldn’t say people cashing in on their bonds is causing any strain now
Me:
Bonds do not plug government debt. That’s like saying a mortgage plugs the debt on your house. Bonds exacerbate the debt, albeit delaying it at the same time. Taking out a loan does not help debt; it makes it worse. That’s about as basic an economic fact as it gets.
Ben:
Bonds create a means of capital gains for the government or municipality issuing them, that yes delays and increases it, but also plugs the hole. In the same way a mortgage allows you to buy a house you can only really afford if you save fo…r several years to buy otherwise. A line of credit that allows your liquidity now on your future assets and current income.
Particularly considering that the government should have a net income, and I’m sure we agree on that, they’d more than make up for it while easing the current burden.
